Some House Rules

The sci-fi Universal Skirmish System

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Sirrob01
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Re: Some House Rules

Postby Sirrob01 » Sat Apr 09, 2011 4:52 am

Still a little hard for me to say if they are fully overpowered but I do know you'd be a mug to not take the max amount of IF AOE weapons in fielded army, they provide a definite above avg hitting power for points spent and on SI no matter the advantages taken are brutal.

This again might be the point as it does provide PI with a distinct tactical and point advantage over SI. However I've always run under the impression an army of lower tech militia guys would stand an even chance of defeating a higher tech all robotic race type army due to the pointing system used. I'm starting to see this as less and less the case which is maybe the way it's meant to be.

Adding aug can help but then I'm left also adding more points per unit fielded until in the end I start to question is my SI +2 infantry with a pile of Aug's really as effective as PI 0 AR unit with no aug and yet the point costs equilise to the same (or so close the 20-30 points less per unit is lost in an overall army)? Admittedly I'd have to do full on statistical analysis to work this out but on the face of it I'd have to think not. Raw armour power especially @ 0 is very effective and provides a visible tactical advantage.

Maybe it's not a problem with IF maybe the pointing system is overall is to tight ie not enough difference between SI/PI and vehicle stuff such that when you look at 1000 point field 50-60 point advantage is really lost due to the in ability to field anything in that 50-60 points.

Are APC's immune to AOE? I thought if they were caught in the blast radius the opponent would still roll a roll at -5 penalty, requiring an APC to have -3 AR to really totally avoid the potential for cluster fire just lucking it to death due to volume of d10's rolled. If this isn't the case and all vehicles get to ignore AOE, APC's will become mandatory for me.

Don't get me wrong I still like the rules especially moral/initative, It would just be nice to get some feedback from the designer on what the thinking was. I hate tinkering with rule sets as you can then unbalance something else causing even bigger problems.

I did have a quick game against Carb were the IF rules really fell apart, basically the only reason my troops didn't die 6 times over was that we played at 15mm movement so they were effectively very very spaced out. However if it'd been at normal movement I'd lost both units by the 2nd turn and 1 vehicle for his lose of zero of his units(My guys were all hiding inside medium terrain). This against the clone army who don't even exploit the IF rule, but just have a little IF as flavor.

smokingwreckage
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Re: Some House Rules

Postby smokingwreckage » Sat Apr 09, 2011 1:27 pm

Yeah an APC could get plinked to death but that would require quite a few 10s using 5+ hits. Big AOEs with 5+ are going to be 50 points or more each. To get ten goes at a kill on 10+ requires 500 points or more. Not very economical. PDS to counter such plinking is only 5 points per damage capacity, or say 15-25 points. An infantry artillery jammer is only 25 points per squad. In any case a decent IF weapon costs way more than the counter-measures.

I suggest trying the game at 2500 points. The "competitive battles" rules suggest 2000-4000 points and no less than 1000, but at 1000 it's possible to get royally screwed by a single volley or weird weapons miss-match.

I would absolutely have APCs as a must-have for an army with lots of light infantry.

My opinion is that the game punishes you very harshly if you don't work to cover your weaknesses and exploit your advantages. If you're heavily biased toward SI you need to grab anything that will reduce your casualties from artillery.
-Sam

Sirrob01
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Re: Some House Rules

Postby Sirrob01 » Sat Apr 09, 2011 11:35 pm

I managed to build a nasty 1 shot braced rocket launcher which had a nasty range plus IF on 4" +5 which cost 9 points...I was trying to exploit the rules this gave max versatility load up with 1-unlimted number of shots through sidearm purchasing providing the troops carrying it with a massive intimidation factor after the first game. ie opponent wont know if there a 1 shot wonder or be raining death on them for 6 turns and hence potentially over commitment resources to remove them from the game. I was trying hard to abuse the rules.

I'll have to give it a shot, I'll see if I can talk Carb or someone else into another game, need to get a "real" table top built up so we can use proper 28mm movement.

Yes I was hoping Terrain mastery and smoke would help negate the AOE effect which they do quiet well when the AOE weapon is used in LOS fire mode. Just when you fire it IF mode both those advantages are totally negated and terrain is negated leaving you effectively sitting in the open. Greater than 15" away if the targets in cover you'd never fire out of IF mode...unless of course it is meant to be exploding on tree tops (p42 the italics text in the little box at the end of the first column, which would help unless it was cluster fire :/). Just seems overally harsh to have all those things negated by 1 fairly standard fire mode.

I'd be better of re-tooling the army, to remove the SR/TR spent on terrain mastery and sink it into more adhoc % or more vehicle % or even a different tac advantage.
This would be a shame as then I can't really see the use of the terrain mastery tactical advantage it costs 3 TR to buy 15% of your standard 20 points and the advantage can be negated by simply firing in IF mode? None of the other tac advantages are as easy to defeat, as per other thread reservists are practically unstoppable and cost 1/3 the TR points :?:

((it's starting to look like we are monopolizing this board :) ))

smokingwreckage
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Re: Some House Rules

Postby smokingwreckage » Sun Apr 10, 2011 12:25 pm

You don't have to let your opponent know what Augmentations you're using, but he is entitled to check out your weapons, etc., so he'd know - if he thought of it - whether that weapon was going to rain death. IMO you should continue to try hard to abuse the rules. Defiance has a lot of scope for entertaining weapons.
-Sam

Sirrob01
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Re: Some House Rules

Postby Sirrob01 » Mon Apr 11, 2011 9:08 am

Do you have to reveal how many copies of said firearm your infantry are carrying?

I haven't looked them over to closely but phase weapons are another area I want to poke around in, I think plenty of scope there for interest although I'll avoid phasing bracing expanded weapons...

smokingwreckage
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Re: Some House Rules

Postby smokingwreckage » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:08 pm

Two-part combo phasing bracing expansive weapons with one 60" and one 30" flat range brackets, IIRC.
-Sam


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